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BBJ/BBJ2 ETOPS 180min

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    BBJ/BBJ2 ETOPS 180min

    Hi guys

    I was just wondering about the ETOPS certification of the BBJ/BBJ2. I just found ETOPS 180min articles dated back to 2003.
    Is this the current ETOPS certification for the BBJ/BBJ2?

    How they manage to fly the BBJ to Antarctica for example?

    Thanks for help
    Bruno Emmenegger

    #2
    Correct, ETOPS 180 is the current BBJ certification.
    It's sufficient to reach Antarctica. Not exactly the South Pole, but most bases are closer to the shore anyway.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Emi View Post
      Correct, ETOPS 180 is the current BBJ certification.
      It's sufficient to reach Antarctica. Not exactly the South Pole, but most bases are closer to the shore anyway.
      I didn't know ETOPS was used on private flights. Is this standard on all flights with the BBJ or only charters?
      -Spencer Hoefer

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by [email protected] View Post

        I didn't know ETOPS was used on private flights. Is this standard on all flights with the BBJ or only charters?
        Well (if needed) ETOPS ensures that you are within range of a suitable airport, which you always have to be - whether it's a private flight or a charter flight. Or have I misunderstood something?
        Anton Vind
        CPU: i9-9900K, GPU: RTX 2080 SUPER, RAM: 32 GB DDR4 3600 MHz, Drives: 2 TB SSD

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Anton Vind View Post

          Well (if needed) ETOPS ensures that you are within range of a suitable airport, which you always have to be - whether it's a private flight or a charter flight. Or have I misunderstood something?
          I could be confusing this with non revenue flights. To my understanding ETOPS is not used on these flights.
          -Spencer Hoefer

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by [email protected] View Post

            I could be confusing this with non revenue flights. To my understanding ETOPS is not used on these flights.
            Well I'm not sure either, what I'm thinking is just that as soon as you're further than 60 minutes of flying away from an airport, ETOPS rules applies, regardless of what type of flight it is, but I could be wrong.
            Anton Vind
            CPU: i9-9900K, GPU: RTX 2080 SUPER, RAM: 32 GB DDR4 3600 MHz, Drives: 2 TB SSD

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by [email protected] View Post

              I could be confusing this with non revenue flights. To my understanding ETOPS is not used on these flights.
              Per FAA regulations ETOPS or no ETOPS depends on how you are operating the aircraft.

              Stateside BBJs are operated under FAR91 (Private) or FAR135 (Charter).

              Under FAR91 ETOPS does not apply.

              Under FAR135 ETOPS is required to fly more than 180 minutes from a adequate airport (twin engine aircraft). Considering the 737NG is only approved for ETOPS 180, ETOPS doesn’t apply here either.

              Under FAA121 (Commerical Air Carrier) ETOPS is required to fly more than 60 minutes from a adequate airport (twin engine aircraft). This is why UAL/DAL etc. require ETOPS approval on their 737NG fleets. Mainland-Hawaii requires ETOPS180.

              Considering ETOPS only begins at > 180 minutes under FAR135 and does not apply at all under FAR91 it really isn’t something most BBJ/BBJ2 owners/operators concern themselves with.

              In the interest of safety, they can still plan/consider the same Engine Out, Depressurization, Engine Out + Depressurization scenarios. Key point being that they are not required to do so!

              Regulations differ across the world and I know of various European (EASA) and UAE (GACA) BBJ operators that have applied for and received ETOPS180 approval.




              Leo Cal

              Comment


              • Lseatflyr
                Lseatflyr commented
                Editing a comment
                Yep - this matches my experiences. It's the safer thing to do to run ETP (Equal Time Point) scenarios (ie engine out, depressurization, medical), but it's not technically illegal to have a "wet footprint" (where you don't have enough fuel to satisfy one or all of the scenarios) on a part 91 flight.
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