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Pfpx weights and ngxu fmc

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    Pfpx weights and ngxu fmc

    Hi all

    Is there an easy way to match pfpx weights with the ngxu fmc for the 800 with winglets, i have seen a couple of confusing workarounds and tried them but i end up just resorting to plugging the zfw from pfpx directly into the fmc,

    id like to set pax,baggage and cargo in pfpx then be able to plug them into the fmc but i never seem to get matching figures, topcat is even further out so just curious if anybody has found a simple solution,thanks all
    Wayne Such

    #2
    Originally posted by Jetman View Post
    Hi all

    Is there an easy way to match pfpx weights with the ngxu fmc for the 800 with winglets, i have seen a couple of confusing workarounds and tried them but i end up just resorting to plugging the zfw from pfpx directly into the fmc,

    id like to set pax,baggage and cargo in pfpx then be able to plug them into the fmc but i never seem to get matching figures, topcat is even further out so just curious if anybody has found a simple solution,thanks all
    I am not familiar with PFPX, but have you edited pfpfx so that certain weights match the NGXu? Is the PFPX’s MTOW, OEW, MZFW match that for the NGXu according to the FMC and aircraft cfg.?

    If your PFPX OEW and MZFW don’t match with the NGXu you won’t get to match the zfw. You also need to find out the per pax weight according to the NGXu’s FMC and match with PFPX’s per pax weight.
    Angelo Busato

    Comment


      #3
      Thanks ill look further
      Wayne Such

      Comment


        #4
        It's 190 pounds per passenger for the NGXu, so if you go into the settings page on PFPX, it'll be under weights, you can change it there. The problem is if you're using the 747 and the 777, they use 195 pounds per passenger, so you'd have to change it again if you change between those planes. From that weight setting page, you can also change the baggage weight, but there's no specific value for this in any PMDG aircraft.
        Captain Kevin

        Kevin Yang

        Comment


          #5
          thanks captain Kevin
          Wayne Such

          Comment


            #6
            The weights for the 800 are:

            OEW 92.8 lbs
            Max payload 46.3
            MZFW 138.3
            MTOW 174.4
            Max fuel 46057
            Niklas Graefe

            Comment


              #7
              Thought i sorted it all the weights matched when i entered them from pfpx in the fmc, fuel cargo and pax and everything lined up in the efb except there was a discrepancy between the pfpx ofp and the efb landing weight, it was 2500 kg greater in the ngx, more testing to work out why but getting there
              Wayne Such

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by threegreen View Post
                The weights for the 800 are:

                OEW 92.8 lbs
                Max payload 46.3
                MZFW 138.3
                MTOW 174.4
                Max fuel 46057
                Did you get the data from the PMDG Aircraft cfg or other source?

                For PFPX I did not see engines type CFM56-7B24 (as in the PMDG Aircraft cfg)
                I see in PMDG aircraft cfg :static_thrust=24200.000 // Thrust by EEC [26300 TO SLS here]

                To verify, in PFPX proper to use CFM56-7B26 engine?
                Last edited by von; 10Jan2020, 08:53.
                Vaughan Martell KDTW

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by threegreen View Post
                  The weights for the 800 are:

                  OEW 92.8 lbs
                  Max payload 46.3
                  MZFW 138.3
                  MTOW 174.4
                  Max fuel 46057
                  Niklas,

                  I think your maths are a little off: If OEW is 92,800 pounds, and MZFW is 138,300 pounds, then max payload must be 45,500 pounds.

                  Vaughan, I can't say how Niklas got his numbers, but I confirmed OEW, MZFW, and MTOW from the FCOM and within the CDU. I admit that I haven't looked at PFPX's engine options for the 737-800. (Yet.)
                  Cheers,
                  Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                  Pinner, Middx, UK
                  System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I'd get the operating empty weight, zero fuel weight, maximum take-off weight, and maximum landing weight from the EFB.
                    Captain Kevin

                    Kevin Yang

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Under the "Performance" section of the Vehicle Select window, OEW is given as 91,300 lbs.
                      However, in the EFB, OEW is given as 92,795 lbs
                      In the CDU, selecting FS ACTIONS>PAYLOAD and zeroing out all pax and cargo, you'll get a ZFW of 92.8 (92,800 lbs).
                      This means the empty airplane in the sim is heavier than the "book" value given in the "Performance" section of the config.
                      The effective OEW in the sim is 92,800 lbs.

                      The "Performance" section of the Vehicle Select window, the CDU and the EFB all show MTOW as 174.4 (174,400 lbs).

                      The EFB shows MZFW as 138,300.

                      In PFPX, you'll need to edit your aircraft data to make it line up. Presumably, you've already added a 737-800 to your aircraft database to use in planning, so we need to edit that entry:

                      1. Click the aircraft icon and open the aircraft database, which brings up the aircraft list window.
                      2. Highlight your 737-800 and the click the "edit" icon at the top of the Aircraft List window. You should now see the Aircraft Editor window and your 737-800's registration number should be in the registration number field.
                      3. In the Engines field, ensure that the CFM56-7B26 engine is selected.
                      4. In the Empty Weight field, enter 92800.
                      5. In the Max Zero Fuel field, enter 138300.
                      6. In the Max Takeoff field, enter 174400.
                      7. In the Max Ramp field, enter 174900.
                      8. In the Max Landing field, enter 146300.
                      9. Set Pax Capacity to 160 for dual class or 184 for single class cabin configuration.
                      10. In the Cargo capacity field, enter 15105.
                      11. In the Fuel capacity field, enter 46057.
                      12. Click the Save button and select Save as Template. Save it as "PMDG Boeing 737-800 NGXu".
                      13. Back in the Aircraft Editor window, click Save again and this time save the aircraft itself.
                      14. Close the aircraft list window.

                      Your PFPX planning should be closer now.

                      Apologies if this is too much detail.
                      Last edited by Yoda; 14Jan2020, 09:33.
                      Cheers,
                      Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                      Pinner, Middx, UK
                      System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                      Comment


                        #12
                        the EFB oew is the planes empty weight plus the two galley equipment. The weights it the FCOM is not necessary the ones used, the FCOMs are usually airliner tailored and the one we have license for uses that weights. We use the weights as described in the airport planning doc from Boeing.

                        Using the efb max weights will be the best course of action for any profile created. These are the numbers I have used for my PFPX and simbrief custom profiles
                        Chris Makris (Olympic260)
                        PMDG Technical Support
                        http://www.pmdg.com

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Thanks, Chris. Why is there such a large difference between the MTOW in the FCOM and the one in the EFB/CDU?
                          Cheers,
                          Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                          Pinner, Middx, UK
                          System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                            Thanks, Chris. Why is there such a large difference between the MTOW in the FCOM and the one in the EFB/CDU?
                            As I wrote we are using the numbers from Boeing Airport Planning document and use the largest possible values from that document. The FCOM we have license to distribute with the product can mention other numbers as there are other options offered.
                            Chris Makris (Olympic260)
                            PMDG Technical Support
                            http://www.pmdg.com

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Thanks, Chris. Interesting.
                              Cheers,
                              Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                              Pinner, Middx, UK
                              System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                                Under the "Performance" section of the Vehicle Select window, OEW is given as 91,300 lbs.
                                However, in the EFB, OEW is given as 92,795 lbs
                                In the CDU, selecting FS ACTIONS>PAYLOAD and zeroing out all pax and cargo, you'll get a ZFW of 92.8 (92,800 lbs).
                                This means the empty airplane in the sim is heavier than the "book" value given in the "Performance" section of the config.
                                The effective OEW in the sim is 92,800 lbs.

                                The "Performance" section of the Vehicle Select window, the CDU and the EFB all show MTOW as 174.4 (174,400 lbs).

                                The EFB shows MZFW as 138,300.

                                In PFPX, you'll need to edit your aircraft data to make it line up. Presumably, you've already added a 737-800 to your aircraft database to use in planning, so we need to edit that entry:

                                1. Click the aircraft icon and open the aircraft database, which brings up the aircraft list window.
                                2. Highlight your 737-800 and the click the "edit" icon at the top of the Aircraft List window. You should now see the Aircraft Editor window and your 737-800's registration number should be in the registration number field.
                                3. In the Engines field, click the drop-down arrow and select the CFM56-7B24 engine. This will change the values in the weight fields, but we're going to edit them next.
                                4. In the Empty Weight field, enter 92800.
                                5. In the Max Zero Fuel field, enter 138300.
                                6. In the Max Takeoff field, enter 174400.
                                7. In the Max Ramp field, enter 174900.
                                8. In the Max Landing field, enter 146300.
                                9. Set Pax Capacity to 160 for dual class or 184 for single class cabin configuration.
                                10. In the Cargo capacity field, enter 15105.
                                11. In the Fuel capacity field, enter 46057.
                                12. Click the Save button and select Save as Template. Save it as "PMDG Boeing 737-800 NGXu".
                                13. Back in the Aircraft Editor window, click Save again and this time save the aircraft itself.
                                14. Close the aircraft list window.

                                Your PFPX planning should be closer now.

                                Apologies if this is too much detail.
                                Are your weights confirmed? Just trying to get everything updated in Topcat and PFPX.
                                David Zill

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Yes, those are the weights in the NGXu, taken from the EFB and the CDU for the -800.
                                  Cheers,
                                  Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                                  Pinner, Middx, UK
                                  System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                                    Yes, those are the weights in the NGXu, taken from the EFB and the CDU for the -800.
                                    "3. In the Engines field, click the drop-down arrow and select the CFM56-7B24 engine. This will change the values in the weight fields, but we're going to edit them next."

                                    I had already set up PFPX but I have only the CFM56-7B26 engine in all B737-800's in the PFPX list?

                                    Also I noticed the CDU and P3D aircraft selection screen for the 737-800 says the engine is 26K

                                    In my earlier post her I mentioned:
                                    For PFPX I did not see engines type CFM56-7B24 (as in the PMDG Aircraft cfg)
                                    I see in PMDG aircraft cfg :static_thrust=24200.000 // Thrust by EEC [26300 TO SLS here]

                                    To verify, in PFPX proper to use CFM56-7B26 engine?
                                    Vaughan Martell KDTW

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                                      Yes, those are the weights in the NGXu, taken from the EFB and the CDU for the -800.
                                      Ok cool. I was confused because all the data including the aircraft.cfg indicate an OEW of 93100lbs, dual class seating for 162, not 160. Additionally, the FMC indicates the engine as '26K' rating, which would be the 26,000lb thrust CFM56-7B26, NOT the
                                      CFM56-7B24.
                                      David Zill

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Vaughan,

                                        I think you're nudging into PFPX support territory there. I used the "PMDG Boeing 737-800 NGX" template (I might be wrong about the name, but that's what I remember), and in the engine field, the default selection was CFM56-7B26, but there is a drop-down arrow on the right edge of the field that let me select the -7B24 engine type. If you don't have a drop-down menu in the engines field for that template, I don't know what to tell you except to go to the PFPX forum and ask there.

                                        David, I'll recheck. I think the -800 uses the -7B24 and the -900 uses the -7B26, but I could be wrong. I'll be able to check in about 45 minutes.
                                        Last edited by Yoda; 13Jan2020, 15:22.
                                        Cheers,
                                        Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                                        Pinner, Middx, UK
                                        System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                                          Vaughan,

                                          I think you're nudging into PFPX support territory there. I used the "PMDG Boeing 737-800 NGX" template (I might be wrong about the name, but that's what I remember), and in the engine field, the default selection was CFM56-7B26, but there is a drop-down arrow on the right edge of the field that let me select the -7B24 engine type. If you don't have a drop-down menu in the engines field for that template, I don't know what to tell you except to go to the PFPX forum and ask there.

                                          David, I'll recheck. I think the -800 uses the -7B24 and the -900 uses the -7B26, but I could be wrong. I'll be able to check in about 45 minutes.
                                          I believe 6-700 use 24, 8-900 are 26.
                                          David Zill

                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                                            Vaughan,

                                            I think you're nudging into PFPX support territory there. I used the "PMDG Boeing 737-800 NGX" template (I might be wrong about the name, but that's what I remember), and in the engine field, the default selection was CFM56-7B26, but there is a drop-down arrow on the right edge of the field that let me select the -7B24 engine type. If you don't have a drop-down menu in the engines field for that template, I don't know what to tell you except to go to the PFPX forum and ask there.

                                            David, I'll recheck. I think the -800 uses the -7B24 and the -900 uses the -7B26, but I could be wrong. I'll be able to check in about 45 minutes.
                                            Kurt,

                                            I just look at my PFPX Templates to verify (screenshot) and I used PMDG737-800 only selection CFM56-7B26 .. and no -7B24 in the drop down list after selecting?

                                            Edit: Also, what does you PMDG CDU and your P3D aircraft selection screen say for engines?
                                            Attached Files
                                            Last edited by von; 13Jan2020, 15:48.
                                            Vaughan Martell KDTW

                                            Comment


                                              #23
                                              Gents, I see the dilemma here. The Performance window in the Vehicle Selection window of P3D says that the PMDG 737-800NGXu is equipped with CFM56-7B24 engines, and the CDU shows the thrust rating at 26K, which would imply that the engines used for the sim are CFM56-7B26s.

                                              I'm going to defer to Chris Makris going forward.
                                              Cheers,
                                              Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                                              Pinner, Middx, UK
                                              System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                                                Gents, I see the dilemma here. The Performance window in the Vehicle Selection window of P3D says that the PMDG 737-800NGXu is equipped with CFM56-7B24 engines, and the CDU shows the thrust rating at 26K, which would imply that the engines used for the sim are CFM56-7B26s.

                                                I'm going to defer to Chris Makris going forward.
                                                Kurt,
                                                Thanks for the follow up.

                                                I need to find the PMDG 737-800 PFPX template that has the 24K/26K choice . I must have missed an update?

                                                I had a look at the aircraft cfg:
                                                performance="Cruise Speed:\nMach 0.789 (455 kts; 842 km/h) \n\nEngines:\nCFM56-7B24 \
                                                The CDU says 26K , The P3D aircraft selection screen says 26K
                                                Vaughan Martell KDTW

                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by Yoda View Post
                                                  Gents, I see the dilemma here. The Performance window in the Vehicle Selection window of P3D says that the PMDG 737-800NGXu is equipped with CFM56-7B24 engines, and the CDU shows the thrust rating at 26K, which would imply that the engines used for the sim are CFM56-7B26s.

                                                  I'm going to defer to Chris Makris going forward.
                                                  Mmmm, maybe this is why TOPCAT's N1 (and V1, VR, V2) differs quite a bit form the NGXu CDU since the release of the NGXu. Never had this issue with the NGX. Does anybody now how to fix this momentarily? Thx
                                                  Sergio Naiberg

                                                  Comment


                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by von View Post

                                                    I need to find the PMDG 737-800 PFPX template that has the 24K/26K choice . I must have missed an update?
                                                    I don't think you're looking in the right place. You called up the Aircraft Templates List, and you need to look at the specific aircraft you're planning for in the Aircraft List. There is an aircraft icon in the top left. If you click that, it gives you a menu, and you should select "Aircraft Database", not "Add Aircraft From Template".

                                                    Cheers,
                                                    Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                                                    Pinner, Middx, UK
                                                    System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                                                    Comment


                                                      #27
                                                      Originally posted by von View Post


                                                      I need to find the PMDG 737-800 PFPX template that has the 24K/26K choice . I must have missed an update?
                                                      Vaughan,

                                                      Download the 'performance' file from AirlinerPerformance and install as instructed. ( I would disable any corresponding .per or .txt equivalent in aircrafttypes ).

                                                      Add a new aircraft registration using the 'add new aircraft' option and not from template.

                                                      Adjust weights and capacities to match.

                                                      You can create your own template from that if required using the function.


                                                      Regards

                                                      Stephen Cooke

                                                      For PFPX aircraft performance files visit: AirlinerPerformance.net

                                                      Comment


                                                        #28
                                                        Originally posted by Yoda View Post

                                                        I don't think you're looking in the right place. You called up the Aircraft Templates List, and you need to look at the specific aircraft you're planning for in the Aircraft List. There is an aircraft icon in the top left. If you click that, it gives you a menu, and you should select "Aircraft Database", not "Add Aircraft From Template".
                                                        The reason I looked / checked there was because you mentioned:
                                                        "I used the "PMDG Boeing 737-800 NGX" template"

                                                        Vaughan Martell KDTW

                                                        Comment


                                                          #29
                                                          I did, in order to create the entry in the Aircraft Database. I then went into the Aircraft List to edit the entry to make the engine change.
                                                          Cheers,
                                                          Kurt "Yoda" Kalbfleisch
                                                          Pinner, Middx, UK
                                                          System Spec: Intel Core i9-9900KF @3.6GHz, 32GB 2400MHz DDR4 RAM, Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080 Super 8GB

                                                          Comment


                                                            #30
                                                            Originally posted by srcooke View Post

                                                            Vaughan,

                                                            Download the 'performance' file from AirlinerPerformance and install as instructed. ( I would disable any corresponding .per or .txt equivalent in aircrafttypes ).

                                                            Add a new aircraft registration using the 'add new aircraft' option and not from template.

                                                            Adjust weights and capacities to match.

                                                            You can create your own template from that if required using the function.

                                                            Stephen,
                                                            I assume you are using them?

                                                            Are those official PMDG data/performance files or user supplied/edited data?

                                                            Does the PMDG -800 selection there give the -24k / - 26K engine choices for PFPX?
                                                            Vaughan Martell KDTW

                                                            Comment


                                                            • DDowns
                                                              DDowns commented
                                                              Editing a comment
                                                              As far as I know, PMDG has only provided a PFPX profile for the DC-6. All others are 3d party, some are quite good but I prefer going to the PFPX forum hosted by Aerosoft where they have a downloads section so you know the source before you download.
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