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P3D NGXu product line update expected?

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    P3D NGXu product line update expected?

    After the -700 for MSFS being released? Maybe?
    Bai Jian

    #2
    I highly doubt it. As RSR said in an interview P3D sales are down 90% so I can’t see them spending development resource on a platform that’s commercially dead.
    Mark Flynn

    Comment


      #3
      Also, what would they be updating.
      Captain Kevin

      Kevin Yang

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Captain Kevin View Post
        Also, what would they be updating.
        NG3 includes bug fixes that were reported by NGXu users. At the very least, they could port those back. And LNAV, of course.
        Alex Pugh

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by AirBadger View Post
          NG3 includes bug fixes that were reported by NGXu users. At the very least, they could port those back. And LNAV, of course.
          Copy. Wasn't aware of that. I think the 747 was supposed to be the first to get the LNAV update unless anything has changed with that.
          Captain Kevin

          Kevin Yang

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Mark1102 View Post
            I highly doubt it. As RSR said in an interview P3D sales are down 90% so I can’t see them spending development resource on a platform that’s commercially dead.
            Doubtful they will increase without any updates and improvements. Self-fulfilling prophecy…

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by StachM View Post

              Doubtful they will increase without any updates and improvements. Self-fulfilling prophecy…
              Sales have nothing to do with updates, people who are no customers don't get notified about them. Sales have to do with the platform the addon is for and P3D has simply lost its civil clientel. Not because PMDG hasn't released a new addon but because the sim is old, rusty and because the customers have no faith that it will change anytime soon. Every dev tells the same story. Maybe some quality updates/fixes will come to the P3D products and only PMDG will be able to estimate it but I personally doubt that there will be much new stuff.
              Ryzen 9 5900X, RX 6900XT, 32GB DDR4 RAM @3600MHz, 4k
              Marc Eland
              GFO Beta

              Comment


              • Arty57
                Arty57 commented
                Editing a comment
                I disagree with a portion of your statement. “Not because PMDG hasn’t released a new Addon…”

                If PMDG released a product, today, for P3d I believe t would sell as well as any of their previous products. Problem is, they’ve not released new product in almost two years now. That is the primary reason for a dearth of P3d sales

              • Ephedrin
                Ephedrin commented
                Editing a comment
                Arty57 of course I can only speak for myself but my general impression of people in social media is that most people share this feeling. If I purchased an expensive addon for P3D now I would think it‘s wasted money since I would a) expect to be tired of P3D soon again and b) I would ask myself for how long the company will continue to support the product. Milviz for example have sold their King Air since 2019 I believe and now, only 3 years later, it has been dropped. No further improvements for P3Dv5 updates and the cockpit is way too dark. 90€. Several other addons have stopped working correctly and it was already said that they won‘t get fixed. The MV wx radar for example.
                PMDG have spoken about continuous development for P3D but since then there has been no release, the last release was the 777 expansion which came before MSFS. Nobody can currently tell what the next release will bring but from an economical standpoint I don‘t expect them to put more effort into the platform IF the next release shows the same 90% or so reduction of sales. I wouldn‘t risk that for a sim that hasn‘t seen major improvements since the 64bit conversion.

                And PMDG is only one of the big P3D developers. Other devs have stated the same: sales are totally down. I don‘t think PMDG would change that on their own, people would rather ask them why P3D and not MSFS.

              #8
              P3d sales are down simply because the products are in fine shape for P3d users, although some updates are needed. The majority of new sim users are MSFS types, many of them Xboxers, who are waiting for the 737, which may be too complicated for a lot of them, especially those who aren't looking for realism.
              Bob Zolto

              Comment


              • StachM
                StachM commented
                Editing a comment
                It will be interesting to see how big the MSFS market for study-level aircraft really is. I see a lot of people already scoff at the price of the Leonardo Maddog, which is supposed to be released for MSFS this Saturday, at a lower price than the P3D version.

              • Arty57
                Arty57 commented
                Editing a comment
                Yes, lots of negative comments concerning price over the Maddog and it is an undeniable fact the Maddog is every bit as detailed and “study level” as any PMDG product. I believe he PMDG love affair may be short lived once pricing becomes apparent.

              • Ephedrin
                Ephedrin commented
                Editing a comment
                The Maddog indeed seems extremly expensive considering that other aircraft have barely exceeded the 50$ mark yet, with few exceptions. Most people haven‘t experienced the high fidelity of Leonardo‘s or PMDG‘s aircraft yet and given how totally basic many questions in the MSFS forum are it‘s no wonder why that is. Someone who struggles to dial in an ILS into a C172 can probably not imagine what a full fidelity „study level“ airliner has to offer and he would probably be completely frustrated if he just tried to turn the battery on. But these people need our hand to get started and if they like the sim and like to learn about aviation they will eventually understand what a huge effort has been put into these airliners, MD80 or 737, and why they cost so much. And the MD80 is not a „standard 737“ which will sell a million times. My feeling is that the MD80 is slightly overpriced as well but I just take it. I‘m used to 140€ 747s after all 🤣

              #9
              Originally posted by Ephedrin View Post

              Sales have nothing to do with updates, people who are no customers don't get notified about them. Sales have to do with the platform the addon is for and P3D has simply lost its civil clientel. Not because PMDG hasn't released a new addon but because the sim is old, rusty and because the customers have no faith that it will change anytime soon. Every dev tells the same story. Maybe some quality updates/fixes will come to the P3D products and only PMDG will be able to estimate it but I personally doubt that there will be much new stuff.
              Most complaints seem to come from developers who haven't released a quality P3D product in a long time... PMDG is not one of them obviously, but their product line-up is ageing, too. The last novel release for P3D was the NGXu in 2019, the 777 and 747 are even older. Since then, only expansions to existing products have been released, some of which at hefty price tags (not to mention the need to buy the base product). I am not saying that proper LNAV, upgraded navdata encoding, ACARS/GFO, etc. would mean a total reverse of fortunes for the platform, but the fact those updates haven't been delivered doesn't make the existing products more appealing. It is common industry knowledge that the lifecycle of a product can be extended by upgrading/updating it.

              Comment


              • Ephedrin
                Ephedrin commented
                Editing a comment
                Could be, yes. I can only speak for myself, obviously, but I wouldn‘t dare to spend another large amount of money for a PMDG 787 for example for P3D now. Since I have enjoyed MSFS‘ visual quality and overall stability (Su8/9 ignored) I haven‘‘t touched P3D anymore which constantly crashed with dll errors here. In P3d5 all my cockpits are too dark, almost none of my addons’ developers have adjusted the brightness which is a strong indication which direction P3D has taken. This has been the case even before Msfs became such an important part and I doubt that it would change. I wouldn‘t spend money on such an old platform while MSFS and Asobo have proven how it can be done.

              #10
              Originally posted by Ephedrin View Post

              Sales have nothing to do with updates, people who are no customers don't get notified about them. Sales have to do with the platform the addon is for and P3D has simply lost its civil clientel. Not because PMDG hasn't released a new addon but because the sim is old, rusty and because the customers have no faith that it will change anytime soon. Every dev tells the same story. Maybe some quality updates/fixes will come to the P3D products and only PMDG will be able to estimate it but I personally doubt that there will be much new stuff.
              If PMDG were to release the 737 MAX for P3D it would probably sell well. Sales of addons needs new customers but a new product can be bought by existing customers who have stuck with P3D. Long term though the writing is on the wall. The more quality airliner addons produced for MSFS the more P3D users will switch.
              Last edited by Kevin Hall; 30Apr2022, 08:41.

              Comment


              • StachM
                StachM commented
                Editing a comment
                Definitely agree about the 737 MAX, it would have sold like hotcakes for P3D...

              #11
              "Sales have nothing to do with updates..."

              I agree.
              Bai Jian

              Comment


                #12
                To a certain extent sales and updates are tied together. Especially considering PMDG's sales model. Since PMDG does not charge for product updates, their only source of revenue comes from sales. If the amount of P3D sales drops below a given point (only PMDG knows what this point will be), then it no longer makes economical sense for them to continue providing updates for their P3D products. At some point, PMDG will decide to stop supporting their P3D projects. It is not a matter of if that will happen, but when it will happen.
                Tim Lincoln
                My YouTube Channel

                Comment


                  #13
                  Prepar3D is like that girlfriend you had countless good times with, and which you'll never ever forget. But there is a new babe in town, and her name is MSFS.

                  Mark Trainer

                  Comment


                    #14
                    Originally posted by mtrainer View Post
                    Prepar3D is like that girlfriend you had countless good times with, and which you'll never ever forget. But there is a new babe in town, and her name is MSFS.
                    That software that keeps crashing and doesn't feel like a PC program (no undocking, childish UI, etc) and that cancels your simming plans every time it wants run a 2 hour long update downloading individual files without even giving you a choice... This new babe has a long way to go if she wants to make Prepar3D obsolete.
                    Omar Josef
                    737 FO
                    757/767 rated
                    Spain

                    Comment


                      #15
                      Originally posted by mtrainer View Post
                      Prepar3D is like that girlfriend you had countless good times with, and which you'll never ever forget. But there is a new babe in town, and her name is MSFS.
                      I'm still seeing P3D, FSX, and XP11 too.

                      Comment


                        #16
                        I think updates will come to P3D sooner or later. I don't think PMDG and other plugin creators will forget about us P3D lovers. I love my P3D and I will for a long time. on Friday I acquired the MSFS and the truth is that it has improved since it was launched in 2020, personally it is on the right track but obviously it will have to go a long way to dethrone P3D and XP... meanwhile I am training and looking for a software that allows me to fly with a mouse like YOKE lol but I don't really regret buying MSFS it has some bugs with the AI ​​but I'm having fun with it too
                        Steven Silva

                        PMDG 767 for P3D/MSFS

                        Comment


                          #17
                          Originally posted by mtrainer View Post
                          Prepar3D is like that girlfriend you had countless good times with, and which you'll never ever forget. But there is a new babe in town, and her name is MSFS.
                          And whilst she may look very pretty it’s all skin deep. Scratch below the surface and there are so many faults you soon realise looks aren’t everything.

                          When I’m at FL350 flying over overcast conditions what exactly are the benefits of MSFS? Zero as far as I can see.

                          Regarding fixes to the existing NGXu the fact that sales have dropped is irrelevant. Every customer is entitled to a product with no major flaws. PMDG should show some loyalty to their P3D customer base.
                          Cheers,
                          Ray Proudfoot

                          (Cheshire, England)

                          Cheadle Hulme Weather

                          Comment


                          • Mad_X
                            Mad_X commented
                            Editing a comment
                            For example that your clouds span till the horizon and not only 80 miles around you.

                          • RayP
                            RayP commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Mad_X, useful but not enough to make me switch.

                          • VHOJT
                            VHOJT commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Couldnt agree more with you Ray

                          #18
                          I have mixed feelings about this. I have to say the visuals in MSFS blow me away - they are thousands of times better than P3D and I’m frankly sick of the constant problems and niggles on that platform (in P3D v5 I keep getting really dark cockpits for no reason whatsoever, and the ‘Enhanced Atmospherics’ option is embarrassingly bad in my view).
                          However, I have to agree with Ray. I’ve spent a lot of money on PMDG P3D products and it would be very unfortunate to have to fork out again to port to MSFS and receive no updates for what I’ve paid for.
                          That said, I had to do that from FSX to P3D, so maybe shouldn’t complain. The flight dynamics/physics in MSFS are laughable at the moment. I shall be very interested to see how PMDG have overcome this with the 737 and beyond(although I plan to hold out for the -800 release as the airlines I like simulating don’t have the -700).
                          Last edited by rondon9898; 02May2022, 22:40.
                          Flight Sim Guides YouTube Channel

                          John Price

                          Comment


                            #19
                            I am with p3d v.5.3 and the only issue I have is with the 737ngxu that has an intermittent problem from cold and start. Sometimes after apu start up, transfer of power from the engines fails.
                            I have never been able to pin down what causes this, maybe 1 in 25 start ups. I have not had this in any other version of p3d, I have gone through windows installs and pmdg installs and the problem have remained. Support ticket you may say, maybe but only if advised to do so. I do not want to waste anyone's time.
                            Alan D Metcalf

                            Comment


                              #20
                              Just like P3D and FSX the flight dynamics of all aircraft in MSFS are down to the aircraft developer. Default aircraft are never going to have had much time spent on them. There are a number of good payware addons which fly as well or better as anything in P3D. PMDG already have the DC-6 out, showing what they can do in MSFS.

                              I've spent a lot of money on P3D scenery, but mostly at sale prices. I'll still be benefitting from that until all the aircraft I use are available in MSFS. That could be years.

                              Comment


                                #21
                                Originally posted by Marshall01 View Post
                                I am with p3d v.5.3 and the only issue I have is with the 737ngxu that has an intermittent problem from cold and start. Sometimes after apu start up, transfer of power from the engines fails.
                                I have never been able to pin down what causes this, maybe 1 in 25 start ups. I have not had this in any other version of p3d, I have gone through windows installs and pmdg installs and the problem have remained. Support ticket you may say, maybe but only if advised to do so. I do not want to waste anyone's time.
                                I purchased the cargo version yesterday, so I must be a statistic😊 The problem is happening in that version also.
                                Alan D Metcalf

                                Comment


                                  #22
                                  Some people will agree, some people won't agree but it is difficult to deny the fact that each new day that rise, more people are leaving P3D than people coming to that sim.
                                  Please tell me how a new simmer will ever hear about P3D those days? Add to this that the P3D graphisms are not quite appealing for a new simmer.

                                  So the P3D market is shrinking days after days. And a large part of the P3D users are in a waiting mode: It means, that they still use P3D, they haven't jumped yet to msfs but at the same time, tend not to spend a lot anymore on a sim they know they might abandon in a few weeks or months.

                                  A third reason is that most P3D users probably already have the most common add-ons (PMDG, etc) or so many add-ons, that they less feel the need to buy more add-ons.

                                  All those reasons make that P3D which was already a niche market at it's prime is less and less a profitable market for developers. Let's say PMDG spend a complete month to update the Ngxu with a free update, will it bring more new sales? and if they make it payware, how many will buy it?
                                  Stephane Dirand

                                  Comment


                                    #23
                                    Originally posted by gordon24 View Post
                                    Some people will agree, some people won't agree but it is difficult to deny the fact that each new day that rise, more people are leaving P3D than people coming to that sim.
                                    Please tell me how a new simmer will ever hear about P3D those days? Add to this that the P3D graphisms are not quite appealing for a new simmer.

                                    So the P3D market is shrinking days after days. And a large part of the P3D users are in a waiting mode: It means, that they still use P3D, they haven't jumped yet to msfs but at the same time, tend not to spend a lot anymore on a sim they know they might abandon in a few weeks or months.

                                    A third reason is that most P3D users probably already have the most common add-ons (PMDG, etc) or so many add-ons, that they less feel the need to buy more add-ons.

                                    All those reasons make that P3D which was already a niche market at it's prime is less and less a profitable market for developers. Let's say PMDG spend a complete month to update the Ngxu with a free update, will it bring more new sales? and if they make it payware, how many will buy it?
                                    Well if graphics and a few other things are the problem we could agree that it'd be as easy for whomever owns the FSX/P3D license to continue developing the sim for the niche group that we always were. The fact that kids are excited about MSFS for XBOX doesn't mean that aviation enthusiasts (mostly pilot wannabes and pilots couldn'tbes) will levitate towards a more serious less gamy platform.

                                    Today I flew the MAX to Rome and during the turnaround one of the passengers came to the cockpit to drool all over the place. He reminded me of myself 20 years ago. There are still and there will always be people who will know the difference between a product that is clearly being treated as a game by the developer and another product that has no intention of becoming a massively adopted program. As far as the development I've been following from a few developers, it looks like bringing serious study airplanes to MSFS is nothing short of a fight against a platform that is simply not study sim friendly.
                                    Omar Josef
                                    737 FO
                                    757/767 rated
                                    Spain

                                    Comment


                                      #24
                                      IMO, MSFS have bring much more simmer/gamer into this wide group rather than convert all P3D user into MSFS user.
                                      But, still, that's likely few more order of magnitude potential consumer in MSFS than P3D, it's logic to spend same resources to build even new add-ons (like MAX) into MSFS than into existing P3D users, same input, output (income) from P3D maybe not worse than before MSFS, but surely much, much better in MSFS for now.

                                      BUT, showing they still care their existing customer by releasing some crucial bug fixes at least would be also be impotent for conversing your new customer that you do care, what if MSFS12 or some even better platform from different developer would came out in few years and break all existing add-ons again? Who would take care of them then?

                                      Look at CS, they
                                      abruptly move to MSFS with some...well you see... and brake many promise made in P3D (76F, 732 for v5, 727.707 for v4 etc....). it doesn't even matter what the ( ) they have putted in MSFS, their reputation already vanished as soon as they abandon 76F project. Even then I assume they might made a tone of money just out of their few MSFS releases just by the brute force of get in very large market.
                                      Oh, and even they have made few patches to 737cl after their MSFS release....
                                      ZHU Hai
                                      B737 Ground instructor

                                      Comment


                                        #25
                                        见头像知白老师😁

                                        Frankly speaking what PMDG is letting customers down is not the quality of their new products but their inconsistency of attitude. Last year after ONE SINGLE statement, saying that they won't cease development in P3D product line and giving a debrief on item to be developed, PMDG had never mentioned them again. We've all seen the outcome of GFO, so who knows what's next to those "promises"? Can I just say PMDG has lost its faith? This has nothing to do with revenue, expecially in a much smaller market like flight simming. I would regard my purchase of NGXu and 777 for P3Dv5 as 补票, but I don't think I will invest into PMDG any more.

                                        Also I just can't say PMDG is still good at quality things. E.g. LNAV in those live streams, is far from satisfying. As an old Chinese saying goes, 逆水行舟不进则退 (meaningly, one will fall back if not making progress in reverse condition), there has been various add-on developers out there which implemented RNP functions and RF leg capabliity. PMDG is giving me an impression of staying still without progressing into tougher challenges.
                                        Kingfu Chan

                                        Comment


                                        #26
                                        I am glad to see PMDG support MSFS. That said I am very happy with P3D 5.3 HF2 and PMDG. I have a lot of scenery and hardware for P3D that is supported for PMDG. It is nice having the hardware for the MCP and FMC. For me the PMDG 737-800 is working great
                                        Dean Salman

                                        Comment


                                          #27
                                          I also want the Lnav update and the MAX for P3D. But some people is complaining as if PMDG said they cease P3D development, they didn't. So let's assume that they will resume P3D development after the MSFS development settles a bit. After all, PMDG is a business, so they take priorities with business in mind.
                                          Joan Alonso

                                          Comment


                                            #28
                                            Originally posted by Captain Kevin View Post
                                            Also, what would they be updating.
                                            Among other things the wrong engine thrust ratings they put on the BBJ.
                                            Sterling Paulsen

                                            Comment


                                              #29
                                              Well, having actually used the NG on MSFS, I must say that there is no way I would ever purchase a PMDG add-on for P3D again. The plane is gorgeous, runs well, has all functionalities and is part of a living-breathing platform that is light years ahead.

                                              Just landed on Ushuaia and saw some whales swimming around the glaciers…visuals and simulation combined is a killer combo.
                                              Thiago Braun - MSFS

                                              Comment


                                                #30
                                                Originally posted by GCBraun View Post
                                                Well, having actually used the NG on MSFS, I must say that there is no way I would ever purchase a PMDG add-on for P3D again. The plane is gorgeous, runs well, has all functionalities and is part of a living-breathing platform that is light years ahead.

                                                Just landed on Ushuaia and saw some whales swimming around the glaciers…visuals and simulation combined is a killer combo.
                                                Apart from the scenery what significant differences are there between the P3D model and the one for MSFS. Everything you have described is fine for me in P3D without the problem of forced updates, no historical weather and having to download all the scenery you fly over. If it’s cloudy where is the advantage?
                                                Cheers,
                                                Ray Proudfoot

                                                (Cheshire, England)

                                                Cheadle Hulme Weather

                                                Comment

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