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Pause at TOD

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    Pause at TOD

    Hello:

    Would PMDG please re-work the pause at TOD function? It is a crucial part of my ability to sim given other life obligations. Using pause at TOD, fuel continues to be consumed and when un-paused, the airplane (737) sometimes enters into uncontrollable and unrecoverable flight. Maybe a quick exchange with Fenix (DEV of the A320) could provide aid.

    Thanks,

    Aaron Ortega
    Aaron Ortega

    #2
    If you would have searched this, you would already know that this is an ASOBO issue and references to Fenix are not valid because their plane is not "in the sim". I don't know if their ToD works because I don't use it ever, but if it does it is because the Fenix is a Simavionics (I think) program running on your desktop not in the simulator. No one has a ToD solution inside the sim because there is no true pause inside the sim.
    Mark "Crabby" Crabtree AAL311 | PHL
    I7-9700KF | 2070 Super | Honeycomb Alpha/Bravo | MFG Crosswind

    Comment


    • Peter Clark
      Peter Clark commented
      Editing a comment
      It’s not necessarily a platform problem. FlyByWire has a fully working pause at TOD and they are self contained with WASM too.

    • Crabby
      Crabby commented
      Editing a comment
      It is 100% a platform problem. Did you read the development chatter about the FBW TOD? They implemented a work-around not a solution. NONE of the in sim pause options actually pause time. https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t...the-sim/143817

    #3
    This is a MSFS irritation not PMDG... why in the world Asobo choose to do it his way is beyond me. Because of this, I fly a whole lot less that I want to!!
    Brian Murphy FSX- 747-400 / MD-11 / MSFS DC-6/ 737-700

    Comment


      #4
      I've used the "esc" ( the 4 window pop-up) pause for hours at a time with no time passed or fuel used. I wonder if PMDG could toggle that key for the TOD

      Comment


        #5
        Originally posted by TH454 View Post
        I've used the "esc" ( the 4 window pop-up) pause for hours at a time with no time passed or fuel used. I wonder if PMDG could toggle that key for the TOD
        Not sure how you're doing that. That does not work for any add-ons I've ever used. I also causes flight issues when resuming, particularly after an extended period as the OP indicated.
        Matthew Glanden

        Comment


          #6
          Originally posted by mglan80 View Post

          Not sure how you're doing that. That does not work for any add-ons I've ever used. I also causes flight issues when resuming, particularly after an extended period as the OP indicated.
          I believe he's referring to pressing esc, clicking the Load/Save button, then click Open from PC and when that Windows modal box appears (the one that you have to pick a file from), you leave the sim in that state and it will not burn fuel....I have used this successfully on the 737...but it can't be programmed into the pause at TOD function (nor would we want it as its a complete work around from Asobo's total failure to code the pause button properly).

          Once (if) Asobo ever fixes it, all planes in pause will not siphon fuel out of the tanks until empty if you happen to walk away from the PC for a while.

          A completely cludgy way to have a plane with fuel in it when you have pause at TOD on and walk away for an extended time is to estimate how long you'll be gone, and add extra fuel to cover that fuel burn. Not great, but neither is a multi-ton airliner that has been turned into a glider.
          Regards, Steve Dra
          Click here to download my P3D, FSX, 2004 paints at Avsim
          Get my paints for MSFS planes at flightsim.to here

          Comment


          • mglan80
            mglan80 commented
            Editing a comment
            Cool! Didn't realize that.

          • DDowns
            DDowns commented
            Editing a comment
            Yup, works for me as well. Before leaving computer and expecting a TOD pause, first note the TOD ETA and expected fuel on board. Make mental note of it and when back on board adjust as required.

          #7
          What I wonder from a PMDG standpoint is that the plane fueling is handled by the FMC and the PMDG software, so would it be possible for the software to take note of the fuel quantity when pause at TOD engages and then restore those values when the flight is resumed? A way of working around the wacky ASOBO version of what 'pause' means.
          Regards,

          Bob Quick

          Comment


            #8
            To expand on what I posted earlier.

            For short periods of time I use the "ESC" pause and never had any problem with fuel burn, passing of time or control issues after un-pausing. This is for any plane that I happen to be flying.

            I have been doing this for the last 10 months that I have been using MSFS.

            If I know I will be away for an extended time, I'll do the ESC > Load/save > From this PC . (After doing that take a look at the task manager, the Flightsimulater.exe usage will drop to almost 0%)

            I agree that this pause thing is FUBAR, but if PMDG could toggle the ESC key for TOD it would give us a workaround until something better comes along.

            Just to be clear, I am using the default keyboard in controls. MENU > TOGGLE PAUSE >ESC




            ​ ​
            You do not have permission to view this gallery.
            This gallery has 1 photos.

            Comment


              #9
              Originally posted by TH454 View Post
              To expand on what I posted earlier.

              For short periods of time I use the "ESC" pause and never had any problem with fuel burn, passing of time or control issues after un-pausing. This is for any plane that I happen to be flying.

              I have been doing this for the last 10 months that I have been using MSFS.

              If I know I will be away for an extended time, I'll do the ESC > Load/save > From this PC . (After doing that take a look at the task manager, the Flightsimulater.exe usage will drop to almost 0%)

              I agree that this pause thing is FUBAR, but if PMDG could toggle the ESC key for TOD it would give us a workaround until something better comes along.

              Just to be clear, I am using the default keyboard in controls. MENU > TOGGLE PAUSE >ESC




              ​ ​
              You seem to be the only one seeing it work this way. As you may recall we have discussed this before and I tried everything you recommended but I have always seen fuel burn and time pass. It seems everyone else does too so there has to be some other difference. I’ve used the load/save thing but it seems like my brakes tend to get hotter and hotter and I eventually have tire failure when I do it for long periods of time.
              Tom Landry

              Comment


                #10
                (Guide updated 15 September 2020 with permission of OP) You have perhaps heard that MSFS has an active pause feature but what about the traditional FSX style regular pause? There are three kinds of pauses: Active pause (default key: PAUSE): this freezes the plane but everything else goes on… which may end in disaster quickly: only use this when in level flight and to make a small adjustment to something (which may be hard to do while flying). It is not advised for taking screenshots or usin...
                Mark "Crabby" Crabtree AAL311 | PHL
                I7-9700KF | 2070 Super | Honeycomb Alpha/Bravo | MFG Crosswind

                Comment


                • mglan80
                  mglan80 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  That "set Pause" suggestion absolutely does not work for me. I can sit in the A30neo and watch the seconds tick by with the pause set on. None of the animations work, but the plane is still reacting to my commands. It's so bizarre that different people seem to have different effects.

                #11
                Originally posted by Ralgh View Post

                You seem to be the only one seeing it work this way. As you may recall we have discussed this before and I tried everything you recommended but I have always seen fuel burn and time pass. It seems everyone else does too so there has to be some other difference. I’ve used the load/save thing but it seems like my brakes tend to get hotter and hotter and I eventually have tire failure when I do it for long periods of time.
                I don't know what is different then, but the way I have described, is the way it works on my system..
                When you do the load/save, in the task manager, does your FlightSimulator.exe go to 0%?

                Comment


                  #12
                  I have also successfully hit the "Esc" key to pause and it does not burn fuel. I've also put my PC to sleep if I plan to leave for awhile (a few hours or more) and it has responded perfectly upon waking up. Don't know what else I can say but it has worked for me multiple times.
                  Daniel Anziano

                  Comment


                  • TH454
                    TH454 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Glad I'm not the only one that can do this. Are you on the Steam version Daniel ?
                    Last edited by TH454; 26Oct2022, 21:00.

                  #13
                  I thought I would add a couple of screenshots to show what I see on my system.
                  Win 10 PRO
                  MSFS-Steam

                  PMDG -700BBJ
                  SS-1 was taken at 10:17 local.
                  SS-2 I hit the ESC key right after that.
                  SS-3 was taken 32 minutes later at 10:49.

                  The very slight difference between the two, was me messing around and having to do a second SS because I didn't have the task bar up for the time stamp.

                  For all practical purposes they are the same.

                  As I said, time stops, fuel total doesn't change, no control problems after resuming and my VA ACARS stops updating position and logs the pause.
                  If this is some kind of a bug, then it's been on my system since 1/19/2022 (19/1/2022) and I don't want anyone fixing it.

                  1017-1.png


                  ESC-2.png

                  1049-3.png


                  Comment


                  • mglan80
                    mglan80 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Steam version?

                  • TH454
                    TH454 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Whatever the latest steam SU10 is.

                  • mglan80
                    mglan80 commented
                    Editing a comment
                    That is so completely baffling to me. I can position the camera so I can see the fuel when I pause and go to the menu screen like you have and literally see the fuel ticking down. Same with DC-6. Just so, so odd.

                  #14
                  Yes on Steam version for me too.
                  Daniel Anziano

                  Comment


                    #15
                    I

                    Abandon all hope wheels of progress turn very slowly at 1 MS drive


                    image.png
                    Aleks Matrosov

                    Comment


                      #16
                      Hey what so no pause at T/D and no EFB? What else is missing? Auto step climbs missing too? I was half n half in getting it when the EFB releases but now?
                      Last edited by VBHB; 28Oct2022, 09:10.
                      Peter Walsh.

                      Comment


                        #17
                        Originally posted by VBHB View Post
                        Hey what so no pause at T/D and no EFB? What else is missing? Auto step climbs missing too? I was half n half in getting it when the EFB releases but now?
                        The pause at TOD is there, but unfortunately doesn't work the way it's intended to because MSFS's pause function merely pauses the position of the plane rather than the entire simulator, so the plane still burns fuel whilst paused. As for the EFB, it's not really an EFB, but rather a tablet. In any event, that's still a work in progress. As for auto step-climb, the 737 doesn't have it because the FMC doesn't even give you an option to step climb, you can only enter in one altitude at a time as far as I recall. On the 747 and 777, you could enter in the step size, so the FMC would know at what increments you want the plane to climb at, say 2,000 feet, and the auto step-climb could handle that accordingly. This doesn't exist on the 737, so it wouldn't have any way of knowing what you want since it obviously can't read your mind. In any event, unless you are flying the BBJ on a very long flight, chances are the flights are short enough that you would probably only step climb one time anyway.
                        Captain Kevin

                        Kevin Yang

                        Comment


                          #18
                          Originally posted by Dreamflight767 View Post
                          Hello:

                          Would PMDG please re-work the pause at TOD function? It is a crucial part of my ability to sim given other life obligations. Using pause at TOD, fuel continues to be consumed and when un-paused, the airplane (737) sometimes enters into uncontrollable and unrecoverable flight. Maybe a quick exchange with Fenix (DEV of the A320) could provide aid.

                          Thanks,

                          Aaron Ortega
                          Aaron-

                          A number of folks have pointed out various forms of "it is an Asobo thing not a PMDG thing" but I want to correct the discussion here:

                          For C++/WASM products- the communication needed from the sim to say "hey- I'm paused!" was broken in the initial release of MSFS. We flagged this to Asobo back in March of 2021 and then again in September of that year and it was added to their workflow. In the pending SU11 update, we see notations indicating that this has been fixed- and one of the devs at Asobo reached out to us specifically on this topic to be sure we saw that the fix was coming.

                          The SDK functionality for SU11 is still not quite usable (it won't actually allow us to build products yet- oops?) but once a functional SU11 SDK becomes stable we will alter a few lines of code and this little gem of a problem will fade into memory for everyone.

                          I hope that clarifies it for everyone. Thanks for bringing it up, Aaron!

                          Robert S. Randazzo
                          PMDG Simulations
                          http://www.pmdg.com


                          Comment


                          • rquick
                            rquick commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Great news! Fingers crossed.

                          #19
                          Thanks Robert, I very much appreciate the timely update. This is quite a nuisance to us casual users. Cheers!
                          V/r,
                          Al Jordan | KCAE
                          Simming Since: Sublogic - Flight Assignment: A.T.P.

                          Comment


                            #20
                            That is some fantastic news! Didn't know how I was going to justify buying the 777 or 747 when I couldn't pause the sim. Such a simple thing!
                            Matthew Glanden

                            Comment


                            • rsrandazzo
                              rsrandazzo commented
                              Editing a comment
                              Matthew- I know, right? Can you imagine? AHAHAHAHA - RSR

                            #21
                            From initial testing with the SU11 update and the PMDG 737, I still have the same "pause" symptoms.

                            The PMDG built-in pause at the TOD and external auto-pause utilities (WideFS or Simconnect) still leave time advancing and fuel-burndown. Time was observed using the PMDG 737 chronograph function.

                            Having the internal MSFS pause assignments set to default, the 'ESC' key menu remains the only way to pause the sim, which obviously still can't be scheduled or automated.
                            V/r,
                            Al Jordan | KCAE
                            Simming Since: Sublogic - Flight Assignment: A.T.P.

                            Comment


                            • Crabby
                              Crabby commented
                              Editing a comment
                              Yep, still an Asobo issue.

                            #22
                            Originally posted by jordanal View Post
                            From initial testing with the SU11 update and the PMDG 737, I still have the same "pause" symptoms.

                            The PMDG built-in pause at the TOD and external auto-pause utilities (WideFS or Simconnect) still leave time advancing and fuel-burndown. Time was observed using the PMDG 737 chronograph function.

                            Having the internal MSFS pause assignments set to default, the 'ESC' key menu remains the only way to pause the sim, which obviously still can't be scheduled or automated.
                            Take a look a few posts up at #18:

                            "The SDK functionality for SU11 is still not quite usable (it won't actually allow us to build products yet- oops?) but once a functional SU11 SDK becomes stable we will alter a few lines of code and this little gem of a problem will fade into memory for everyone."

                            Needs to have code updated once the SDK is updated for SU11.

                            Matthew Glanden

                            Comment


                              #23
                              Originally posted by danielgduhon

                              For all of you saying "This is an ASOBO issue," it is not. Using ESC does ACTUALLY pause the simulation so this would be a much better implementation. The FBW has a working one, as mentioned by some others, and I have used ESC many times without any issues, even pausing overnight for 6+ hours at a time. PMDG really needs to look into it more than just punting it off to Asobo to receive the blame. I do agree that they need to add a better pause function within MSFS, but there is absolutely a workaround that functions as it should for now.

                              Daniel Duhon
                              -Long time PMDG customer
                              You apparently haven't been paying attention to this issue. PMDG has stated more than once that MSFS does not inform C++/WASM add-ons that the simulator is paused, so the 737 has no way of knowing that the sim has been paused. Therefore all of the systems continue to be simulated, including the engines burning fuel. Non-C++/WASM add-ons are presumably not affected by this (though I vaguely recall some folks saying that they have seen some issues with other aircraft in the past as well). It appears that Asobo may have done something in SU11 to address this, so hopefully, PMDG will be able to utilize whatever change Asobo made and put this particular issue to rest. Though I still do not understand why Asobo felt the need to change the way pause has worked in every flight simulator ever.

                              You mention using ESC to pause the simulator. While this may work for you, other users have reported having difficulty with this particular pause. Also, I could be wrong, but I'm not sure that PMDG can programmatically trigger the ESC pause from within the simulator.
                              Tim Lincoln
                              My YouTube Channel

                              Comment


                              • 77west
                                77west commented
                                Editing a comment
                                Correct, even the new A310 that shipped for free in this latest SU11 is affected. I was trying it out, paused to have dinner, came back after an hour and unpaused, bang, zero fuel. The best we could maybe hope for is a save at TOD so if you are away for more than a few minutes, you can just reload the flight. But then you lose the ability to change time and date for the remainder of that flight.

                                Wes Meyer

                              #24
                              Originally posted by mglan80 View Post

                              Take a look a few posts up at #18:

                              "The SDK functionality for SU11 is still not quite usable (it won't actually allow us to build products yet- oops?) but once a functional SU11 SDK becomes stable we will alter a few lines of code and this little gem of a problem will fade into memory for everyone."

                              Needs to have code updated once the SDK is updated for SU11.
                              Ah, so he did - I missed that sentence. Guess I'll try again after a PMDG update. Thanks Mathew.
                              V/r,
                              Al Jordan | KCAE
                              Simming Since: Sublogic - Flight Assignment: A.T.P.

                              Comment


                                #25
                                Gents,

                                We have been trying to get this implemented, but the functionality for C++/WASM remains broken. We have brought this to Asobo's attention yet again, and we await a proper implementation.

                                It seems it was implemented by someone who didn't understand the importance of checking to see that the implementation worked.

                                The moment they give us something properly functional- we'll get an update out to you.

                                Robert S. Randazzo
                                PMDG Simulations
                                http://www.pmdg.com


                                Comment


                                • jsmarko3
                                  jsmarko3 commented
                                  Editing a comment
                                  "It seems it was implemented by someone who didn't understand the importance of checking to see that the implementation worked." I'm absolutely going to hit someone at work with this gem.

                                • mglan80
                                  mglan80 commented
                                  Editing a comment
                                  Well...shucks.

                                #26
                                Originally posted by rsrandazzo View Post
                                It seems it was implemented by someone who didn't understand the importance of checking to see that the implementation worked.
                                The number of times that I have seen someone implement something based on a single test case, and then express confusion when it provides strange results in pretty much every other use case...
                                Tim Lincoln
                                My YouTube Channel

                                Comment

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